formalisation questions (skipping the two
W->P relations enziwe and akhiwe). Subsequent email exchange not recorded. |
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isiZulu |
shorthand |
temporal to
define it? |
how part comes
about needed? |
POS |
dictionary item
in English |
linguist &
ontologist notes |
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Questions
resulting from trying to formalise |
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-xubene na- |
stuffs |
may
be + or -? |
+ |
V |
component |
IZ.net:
be blended; be compounded; be mixed together; be fused; be mingled, be
coalesced |
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-yimvithimvithi |
part |
+ |
+ |
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in
pieces |
imvithimvithi.
Example: the pieces when the glass shattered. So the act of creating the
parts has happened, and this is about a state of affairs |
state
of affairs of the piece w.r.t. the proken whole? No |
pieces
broken from a whole: whole no longer recognizable |
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amangcozu |
involved
in |
- |
- |
N
pl 5 |
sections |
(btw,
can't exist in the singular?). It is a static part. If you are doing
something, you're doing it bit by bit. Subtype of involved in??? A sequence
of subactivities that are part of the larger activity. Like the activity of
typing a word as part of the activity of typing a sentence. |
is
it really different from involved-in (relating process to sub-process)? In
our INLG16 paper, we lumped involved-in tgether with ingxenye |
Always
in plural = amanconzu meaning a small part of a big whole or part of an
entire process = latest comment often used in repetition of the final stem =
amanconzuncozu |
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fumbatha |
contain
(hand/fist only) |
- |
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V |
contain |
added.
See cell D85. enclosed in the hand/fist |
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similar
question as for mumatha: always properly enclosed, or can it be sticking out
of the enclosed hand, like a spear or knife does? |
Always
enclosed/closed |
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hlanganyela |
done
(collective/group participation) |
- |
- |
V |
take
part |
hlanganyela
and hlanganyele are more like variants, so either ok. entry merged with the
infiinitive ukuhlanganyela |
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to
confirm: lump hlanganyele (of INLG16 paper) and hlanganyela together, or do
we need to say something about the difference? |
I
think we can state the suttle difference brought about by the past perfect
tense -el-e. The infinitive for ukuhlanganyela is most appropriate. |
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ilunga |
part
(for anatomy) |
- |
- |
N
sg 5 |
member
(one of a group) |
part
of a body/joint = a finger is part of a hand = also take the other senses of
'ilungu' |
then
why not ingxenye here? Or can be both, but ilunga is somehow 'better'/more
precise? |
Yes,
more precise |
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ilungu |
member
(human organisation, not flocks etc) |
- |
- |
N
sg 5 |
member
(of council) |
of
parliament/community/family/organization/etc = of being part of an
institution or group |
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ingqikithi |
essential
and immutable part |
+ |
- |
N
sg |
the
essential part…… |
indeed
as our KR08 understandig of essential parthood and also includes immutable
part. |
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ingxenye |
done |
- |
- |
N
sg 9 |
part |
part,
but is also listed under portion in the dictionary. merged ingxenyana with it |
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iqatha |
scattered
portion (meat only) |
+ |
- |
N
sg 5 |
piece
of meat |
(or
chunk or lump, according to IZ.net) |
temporal
because it must come from a larger piece of meat |
Yes |
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given
the comment on isiqephu, this is always a scattered portion, no? i.e.,
physically separated form the whole piece of meat? |
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isabelo |
regions |
may
be + or -? |
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N
sg 7 |
portion |
synonym
of isigaba. IZ.net: allocation; grant; portion; quota; share |
there
are all sorts of different things here. Needs clarification |
Isabelo
is allocation in the sense of a budget. But isigaba is a section. |
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isichibi |
scattered
portion (cloth only) |
+ |
- |
N
sg 7? |
piece
of cloth |
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given
the comment on isiqephu, this is always a scattered portion, no? i.e.,
physically separated form the whole piece of cloth? |
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isigaba |
located
in (regions sensu geographic entities) |
- |
- |
N
sg 7 |
section |
for
privinces/districts etc.. Geographical entities/regions. listed for portion
and seciton, 3 times. Merged here. see also
https://isizulu.net/?isigaba for more approximations |
what
about those broader meanings beyond geography? |
there
are other words like isiqephu etc. |
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to
confirm: I will reduce this to 2D (geographical) entities only, and align it
to located-in |
agreed. |
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isigamu |
scattered
portion |
+ |
+ |
N
sg 7? |
portion,
piece |
piece
chopped off or cut off, anything cut short, according to the blue dictionary.
listed for piece and portion. Merged here. Not in IZ.net |
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isihlephu |
scattered
part |
+ |
- |
N
sg 7 |
piece |
piece
broken off, but not clear whether that piece will have a function once broken
off. IZ.net: fragment; piece; portion |
the
piece is a self-contained thingie, like, say, the ear of a cup, the seating
of a chair? Or could alos be just a chip of the cup (the piece does not have
'identity' as a thing of itself) |
The
main sense is that isihlephu is a piece that does have an identity (or use)
on its own. |
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isijuqu |
part |
+ |
+ |
N
sg 7? |
part,
piece |
also
listed in 'part of'. as it's the part that remains, it's not the piece. the
remainder that stays behind when tearing something off. Has something to do
with size as well. Example ilunga yisijuqu semfe. a bunch of ilunga are the
subsections of the stem of the sugar cane (imfe), and the top ilunga gets
torn off, and the larger remainder of the cane remains. and therefore
isijuqu, not ingxenye. listed twice. Is part, not section |
so,
the 'torn off part of' was part of the whole? Traditionally, parthood does
not consider *how* the parts come about, though. |
Yes.
A part that remains. |
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isinqamu |
scattered
portion |
+ |
+ |
N
sg 7? |
portion….. |
example
if you break a couple of pages from a larger number of pages. It's not
ingxenye, because you have removed it. like in breaking bread. So it is a
scattered part (portion). was listed 3 times, with portion mianly, merged
here. |
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isiqephu |
done.
Portion of solid objects |
+ |
- |
N
sg 7 |
part,
piece |
was
listed twice, under part and under piece |
chapter;episode;seciton
in IZ.net |
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the
solid stuff, is that always a mixture (as with the blood example) or can it
also be so-called 'pure' stuff (not a mixture)? E.g., a portion of the sugar
from the pot of sugar on the table, a sliver of the gold that came from the
bar of gold, a handful of cashew nuts from the amount of cashew nuts in the
bag. and is it always 'scattered', i.e., a separate thingie that's not
attached to the whole, as the bloodsample example is, or can it be
'contiguous' as well, like the left-half of the whole cake or the top 3cm of
all the pap in the pot? it is part of
a solid stuff, and not necessarily scattered. |
it
is part of a solid stuff, not necessarily scattered |
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isiqinti |
moved
to part |
- |
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N
sg 7 |
piece
of land |
has
some inherent locative aspect, more as a part of a place, rather than piece.
Let's move to parts list |
how
does it related to the whole? |
It
is a piece of land that is a small part of a big whole. |
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isithako |
subquantity |
may
be + or -? |
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N
sg 7 |
ingredient,
subquantity |
"OK"
as what? As in 'butter is an ingredient of cake'? And is it always
food-related? Can it be used also for, say, 'solvent is an ingredient of
paint'? Is it for human-made substances only, or for any substances, like
'sand is an ingredient of mud'? And does it relate only mass nouns, or does
it extend also to objects [like: one apple is an ingredient of an apple pie]?
also: supposedly 'prescription' https://isizulu.net/?isithako |
same
questions still, see cell G30 |
It
is an ingredient that has been used to derive a new substance. Food,
medicine, paint, chemical, etc. |
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always
*humanmade* substances? (three of the four examples are, chemical not
necessarily, and I suppose you mean with 'chemical' not one of the elements,
but it has to be a mixture, like gasoline for the car) |
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so? |
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isitho |
part
(body parts) |
- |
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N
sg 7 |
member |
(limb).
Ok = a body part. Can also mean a big leg (singular) izitho (big legs plural) |
then
why not ingxenye here? Or can be both,? Nad what about ilunga which one is
somehow 'better'/more precise, how? |
isitho
is used in relation to body parts. It means parts of a human body. The second
sense is used metaphorically to refer to big/fat legs. It is used more
precisely to refer to parts of human body. |
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izingxenye ezakhayo |
structural
parthoog |
- |
- |
N
pl 10 |
component
parts |
with
a long list at: https://isizulu.net/?izingxenye+ezakhayo: building parts,
constructing parts, producing parts, manufacturing parts, building sections,
constructing sections, producing sections, manufacturing sections, building
halves, constructing halves, producing halves, manufacturing halves |
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mumatha |
contain
(mouth only) |
- |
- |
V |
contain |
example:
'the mouth contains saliva'. Always has to do with something *in* the mouth. |
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always
properly contained in, like the saliva and teeth, or can the object stick out
as well, like a lollipop? |
yes,
must be properly contained in. |
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qukatha |
containment |
- |
- |
V |
contain |
can
be used for both the physical containment (like laptop in bag) and conceptual
containment like in 'your story contains lies', a book contains words.
IZ.net: contain; hold, comprise; include |
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ucezu |
part |
may
be + or -? |
maybe
+? |
N
sg 11 |
part
broken off |
IZ.net:
bit; fragment; piece, chip; slice |
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udengezi |
part,
with extras |
+ |
- |
N
sg |
piece |
shard.
piece of the broken vase/clay pot, and that piece assumed another function |
no
idea how to handle that formally |
This
is the antonymy of isiqephu. While isiqephu has no identiy/or use, udengezi
assumes new identity and use as a result of breaking from a whole. |
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umhlanganyeli |
refined
participation? |
- |
? |
N
sg 1 |
participant |
?
If Ok = used as in those participarting in an act of assault = -hlanganyela
'to come together to execute something/doing something together'. IZ.net also
says just 'participant' |
I
don't know if it's ok; this is what my dictionary listed :). So umhlanganyeli
is more for, 'x participates in
robbery/stabbing/rape/...'?, or, because it's a noun, the umhlanganyeli is
the role that the participants play in the assualt (the 'x' in the previous
sentence)? |
It
is the participant x in (commiting) an action y |
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umqobelo |
portion/piece |
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N
sg 3 |
ingredient |
-qoba
= cut into small pieces. IZ.net also says ingredient |
from
the verb -qoba = extended verb -qob + el (APPLICATIVE) -a |
ah,
but is this then, now as noun, still more of a verb-word (the cuting process)
or more of a noun-word (the small pieces)? How would it be used in a
sentence? N SC-y-umqobelo PC-N? |
It
can be used with the copulative. Utamatisi umqobelo wesaladi. "Tomatoes
are part of a vegetable salad". |
so,
the object |
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umunxa |
spatial'
portion |
- |
- |
N
sg 3 |
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with
my understanding now, it messes up the hierachy, so let me see if I can
refine this a bit. There are the two examples on fireplace and the kitchen
utensils. Does umunxa also apply to, say, the bottom 1/3 of the whiskey glass
where the whiskey is, the area of the garbage bin that still can be filled
up, the north-east quarter of a circle, a corner area of a cube, the yonder
part of the sky, the deserted part of the province? |
No.
It's extending too far and the most preferred or commonly used one would be
'ingxenye' in these instances. |
hmmm.
This doesn't help me specifying the distinguishing characteristic. I don't
see the difference between the kitchen utensils example and, say, a corner area of a cube. Could you try to
explain what's the difference between the two? |
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akhiwe |
done |
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enziwe |
done |
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